“Poroshenko is a fighter. He falls head over heels, gets up and comes at me again.”

The main prize in the Ukrainian presidential elections will be the opportunity to economically “undress” Petro Poroshenko. To win, Vladimir Zelensky needs to remain silent, Yulia Tymoshenko needs to speak, and Poroshenko needs to falsify. The Washington regional committee is seeking a change in the Kyiv elites and is keeping Igor Kolomoisky at a safe distance. Poroshenko is trying to seize control from Arsen Avakov over the heads of the Ministry of Internal Affairs in the regions, and Avakov himself was afraid of the Azov militants getting out of control.

About how he personally lowered Poroshenko from the stairs head over heels, and he got up and again walked towards his opponent, to the observer PolitNavigator to Valentin Filippov said the ex-deputy of the Verkhovna Rada Oleg Tsaryov.

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Valentin Filippov: Oleg, hello

I remember an old joke when the possibility of war with Russia is discussed in Israel. And everyone, of course, is scared because Russia’s population is 20 times larger, its territory is larger, there are as many resources as possible, and, most importantly, all aggressors towards Russia have always suffered defeats.

But, however, there is another argument.

France fought with Russia, and their standard of living is high. Germany was at war - and the standard of living was also high. And so remember whoever.

TZelensky gets up and says:

- “Igor Valerievich, what will happen if we accidentally win?”

Here.

I have a question for you: what can Zelensky do now to lose?

Oleg Tsarev: He needs to appear on screens more often, not as a comedian, but as a presidential candidate. And make such statements in support of Suprun, appear with Sergei Leshchenko and so on. And talk about what he will do next. Talking about how he will cooperate with the IMF, all that. The more he appears as an incumbent candidate, the worse it will be for him.

Valentin Filippov: Are these statements about Suprun an exchange of extra percentages of popular support for support from overseas?

Oleg Tsarev: In general, he already has support from overseas. I know for sure that there are, contacts have now been built, I don’t want to say more than I can say, but the fact that Zelensky is not homeless now is for sure.

Valentin Filippov: That is, the West is, in principle, ready for a president like Zelensky? This would even be an option to soften the situation?

Oleg Tsarev: If the Trump team were serious about Ukraine, then this is simply the best option for them. Because Zelensky is the new elite. They have one problem - to remove Igor Valerievich Kolomoisky from near orbit. Americans cope with this quite well when necessary. He now lives in Israel. I left Switzerland because it was no longer safe. From Israel, as you know...

Valentin Filippov: Yes, Cossacks are not extradited. There is no issue from the Don.

Oleg Tsarev: Yes, there is no extradition from the Don. And this is the only place where he feels safe. Therefore, it is quite easy to isolate it. And it is impossible to say that Zelensky’s victory is definitely Kolomoisky’s victory. Because the West will definitely do something if Zelensky wins, and Kolomoisky knows about it. He knows that the pearl of his business, Privat-ank, was taken away under pressure from the United States.

Two years before the nationalization of PrivatBank, I looked at the calculations of the IMF, who had already estimated and calculated how much the nationalization of PrivatBank would cost the Ukrainian economy and insisted that this should be done immediately, because... spend it once and nationalize it, or then feed Igor Valerievich indefinitely.

But no one wants to watch how money is allocated, because everything that goes through dollar accounts is an open book for the Americans, so they poured water into a bucket, and it poured money through a hole, and they, starting the next day, through Privatbank is starting to siphon...

Valentin Filippov: To Switzerland... to Cyprus

Oleg Tsarev: So this is the situation

Valentin Filippov: Moscow seems to have already stated that it will not recognize Poroshenko’s victory. And everyone else is recognized?

Oleg Tsarev: Tymoshenko and Zelensky – this is what they admit. Yes, by the way, even regarding Poroshenko there is a question whether he will be recognized or not.

Valentin Filippov: Even so. And we hoped.

Oleg Tsarev: Now we’ll see how everything goes, but the Russians have been included in the international observers, so we’ll see whether they will be allowed in or not. Therefore, this is the situation, there may still be nuances.

Valentin Filippov: You are an experienced politician and have been a presidential candidate yourself. Now, in Odessa circles, at least, the moment of Zelensky’s reservation, or not a reservation, is being discussed at a meeting with IT specialists. He began to appeal to the legislation of the Russian Federation, and not to the Ukrainian one. That is, he named the tax rates that are accepted in Russia, and not in Ukraine. What does this have to do with? This is his writer from Yekaterinburg, and they just filled it out, and the lawyer didn’t look?

Oleg Tsarev: It’s difficult for me to say about this, what actually happened there, but, again, I’ll go back to the fact that the less he acts as a presidential candidate, the better it will be for his rating.

Valentin Filippov: Do you know what scared me? Maybe he was originally groomed to become president of Russia?

Oleg Tsarev: Good joke. Yes, they decided: “What difference does it make? Volodya is there, Volodya is here.”

Valentin Filippov: Does Poroshenko still have a chance to bypass Zelensky?

Oleg Tsarev: The gap between Poroshenko and Tymoshenko is small. Therefore, if something breakthrough does not happen for Tymoshenko in the near future, then it is quite possible that she will not get into the second round. Because it is clear that an administrative resource is an administrative resource. And two percent is not the gap in ratings that will allow us to bypass it.

Therefore, Tymoshenko now has a whole series of events that she is planning that will allow her to compete for passage to the second round. If she makes it to the second round, then if she is with Poroshenko, she has very good chances of winning, but if she is with Zelensky, then her chances are not so good.

Valentin Filippov: Then they need to somehow push Zelensky out so that he himself refuses and leaves. Then the question is the following: are these three really fighting seriously? Or is it possible that they will come to some kind of agreement before the elections?

Oleg Tsarev: They fight very seriously. Poroshenko is very motivated to win because he could lose everything. “Undressing” Poroshenko is one of the bonuses. They are already figuring out how to continue making money in Ukraine. Obviously, for Zelensky and his team this is a business project.

So, the opportunity to “undress” Poroshenko is one of the bonuses that can be given to someone. Give someone the tax office, give someone customs, give someone Naftagaz, and so on. These are the topics on which you can earn money, earn a lot, but not so much. Here are the top five topics - these are...

Valentin Filippov: "Undress" Poroshenko!

Oleg Tsarev: So he is motivated to win. Tymoshenko is also very motivated to win, because for her this is the last opportunity to compete for the main prize.

For Zelensky, not long ago he believed that he could win, and the mood in his team is like this... Firstly, everything is fine with them. They say that even if suddenly, due to massive falsification, Petya Poroshenko knocks down Zelensky, and he does not get into the second round or loses in the second round, then the people will be so indignant that it will be guaranteed, according to them, Zelensky will gain more than 50% of the vote. elections to the Verkhovna Rada.

And this option also suits Kolomoisky, because in this case it will be easier for him to control Zelensky. Well, Zelensky will pass, and his deputies will be Palitsa...

Valentin Filippov: Well, yes…

Oleg Tsarev: They will form the Verkhovna Rada. Well, of course the Schaefer brothers will be there...

Valentin Filippov: Do you think that presidential ratings will transfer to parliamentary ratings? It seems to me that they are voting for Zelensky: “Well, what can we do but laugh?” - yes?

Oleg Tsarev: When he gets hurt, when he gets kicked out, then they think he will score a lot. One can argue whether Zelensky will get more than 50% or less than 50%, but the fact that this will be the largest faction in the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine is obvious.

And in this case, the Americans will not control them according to the lists. But when the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine is formed, you will have to live with it. Maybe that’s why Igor Valerievich is now financing Zelensky’s election campaign so weakly, one might say not at all. In fact, the first $5 that was spent on the work of the election headquarters was money from Zelensky’s entourage.

Although Igor Valerievich promised up to $100 in funding, there is no money yet. Moreover, for the advertising that was given for the TV show with Zelensky, 000th Kvartal, films, he should have received money. And Igor Valerievich still owes him this money and writes off advertising for his election campaign on 000+95 at the expense of these debts.

Valentin Filippov: And then will Igor Valerievich be able to come or call Volodya Zelensky and say “Volodya, I promoted you”? Zelensky won’t tell him: “Igor Valerievich, we ourselves are deeply in debt, completely different people helped us”?

Oleg Tsarev: In any case, the quota in his faction will be quite large, because it’s objective: if Zelensky’s headquarters largely consists of Kolomoisky’s people, then they will be promoted further along the lists.

Valentin Filippov: It’s hard to consider myself Kolomoisky’s man if Kolomoisky doesn’t give me money. Although, if this happens, then, probably, I am Kolomoisky’s man. After all, he never gave me money at all.

Oleg Tsarev: Then after the next elections, it will be necessary to finance the elections to the Verkhovna Rada and so on. Life is a complex process, elections are a complex process. And they always do this...

They don’t give him the following: “Here you go for the presidential elections, and when you spend it so as not to go twice, here you go for the parliamentary campaign.” This is a complex process. They give money in exchange for some obligations, talk, negotiate.

And then from a moral point of view...Zelensky was a subordinate of Igor Valerievich. Then go in, open the door with your foot and say: “Free!” - not everyone can.

Valentin Filippov: It seems to me that Zelensky is such an option for the States. It seems that Ukraine has become a fascist country, and the faces here have changed. Moreover, on clowns, right?

Oleg Tsarev: One of Zelensky’s advantages is that he is now not associated with the old elites. And I said, although not in this interview, that I had a friend who really wanted to take part in Zelensky’s elections. Financially. He was at all his corporate events and birthdays. “Vova, now we’ll call Vova.” And Zelensky now has a very serious need for money to finance control over the elections. Election control is carried out by international observers. So, we arrived in Ukraine, we already have staff. And they, of course, want to make money.

Valentin Filippov: And everyone told us: “Russian observers are bad because they have to be paid. But international observers will come, they are independent...”

Oleg Tsarev: I'm not making a discovery, but international observers are almost always paid. And there is still a queue to see who they will take the money from. They don’t want to take money from Poroshenko. And there are only three candidates - Tymoshenko, Zelensky and Poroshenko. Therefore, observers need to be paid, and these are the observers who, when gross falsification occurs, go there, they make a statement, and so on, and so on. Therefore, the observer's position is very important.

It is necessary to pay the commission members and observers on the commission. This is from 25 to 50% of the cost of the election campaign. That's a lot of money. I just conducted elections myself and more than a dozen elections, and I can roughly imagine the budget of the election campaign.

We need to create mobile groups. The mobile group consists of security forces plus a lawyer. When an observer sees falsifications, he calls, and a mobile group, they are scattered throughout the region, arrives, starts filming, starts shouting, and calls the police.

Because it is simply physically impossible to form observers and commission members who will be ready to rush into an embrasure just like that. The most that can be expected is that people will give a signal that something is happening.

On election night, I was constantly driving cars. Well, the Party of Regions, Yanukovych, I traveled to some areas where something was happening. I came there, there were deputies from BYuT there, we shouted at each other for a long time, demanding a recount so that everything would be normal.

Valentin Filippov: Well, I had to observe all this as a journalist.

Oleg Tsarev: So, my comrade was unable to contact Zelensky, the most he could do was contact Shefir, the brothers, and the chief of staff.

In general, Kolomoisky did an interesting thing. He had to finance elections in the regions, at a minimum, and the work of the headquarters. Not all regions, but many, were distributed to members of the local elite, who assumed the costs. That is, he got out very well, in general. He is carrying out a very interesting project together with Zelensky and spends literally pennies.

Valentin Filippov: That is, this is such a showman’s project. A person travels, performs, and as a result raises funds rather than spends them. Well, Zelensky is not used to paying someone money for his appearance in public, that would be stupid.

Oleg Tsarev: In my opinion, there was a similar situation in Ancient Rome, when the peoples of the sea and the peoples of the continent, the Romans fought with Carthage, fought and fought, Hannibal had practically captured Rome, and Carthage, the peoples of the sea, as far as I know, these were quite Semitic tribes . And Hannibal sent desperate letters: “Give me a little more money, I will pay my mercenaries.” And they answered him: “Yes, you captured half of Rome, half of the Roman Empire. Collect locally." No money was given, and Carthage was destroyed. So that Igor Valerievich would not be greedy with his chance, he would not miss such a serious chance.

Valentin Filippov: But let's return to earth, to the current president. We see that he is very nervous, fights at his meetings with voters, and is ready for this, at least. Taps voters. He's mad, really mad. Is there anything else he can learn in the remaining time?

Oleg Tsarev: You and I talked, and I always said that Petro Poroshenko is capable of actions. He is quite active, aggressive and will fight to the end. And there are no things that he will stop at. In general, what we see in Donbass, how he stayed in power, all this time he ruled only through the blood of people. He will fight.

I had such a situation after the Orange Revolution, there was a fight in front of the entrance to the Central Exhibition Complex, police officers were beaten there, there was blood, glass was broken, the front door was broken, and my party genosse called me and said: “Oleg, come from your Dnepropetrovsk to us in Kyiv, we are without It’s very difficult for you.”

A combat group of deputies, the same as the Orange ones, was created. I had an office at the Central Exhibition Complex, where I was constantly located. I organized a duty, it was like in the army, four deputies were on duty at the Central Election Commission day and night in shifts, and when there were some serious days, I gathered up to 20-30 people. And since I started working, they haven’t held a single promotion.

And such a group among the Orange was led by Petro Poroshenko.

Valentin Filippov: I remember. I remember for the rest of my life from 2004 how Petro Poroshenko beats a cop lying on the ground, and also yells at him in a very gangster-like manner: “Sho? Who are you looking at, this is the most...?” It was very convincing. I thought: “Lord, how can this happen? This is just Ukraine, what are you fighting for?”

Oleg Tsarev: For money…..

I had different situations there before... I strained my back... This is Petya Poroshenko, he should have been there... so he storms the podium, I tell him: “Don’t do this,” but he rushes, so actively. No one has ever attacked me so actively before. I lift him up, carry him out, and there is Tolya Pisarenko, an Olympic champion in weight lifting, he accepted it, but I strained my back.

And if some deputies there said “no, no, everything is fine,” then Petya always acted very harshly. And as part of the confrontation during the Orange Revolution, I had to lower him down the stairs several times. And he falls head over heels, gets up and comes at me again.

Valentin Filippov: God protects the drunk.

Oleg Tsarev: He will be there until the last. On the day when Yanukovych was declared president, Seryozha Kivalov spent a very long time agreeing on the conditions under which he would do his job and declare Yanukovych president, Petya Poroshenko and the deputies tried to seize the podium. They beat my friend, we became friends, there was a security officer from Donetsk - either an Alfa member or a Berkut member. And then, just like that, as you say, they beat him up. And, of course, Petya got it from me then, and they were unable to capture the podium.

He's a fighter, yes.

They say: “Well, he got his ass kicked in Crimea.” Who else among the Ukrainian politicians came and walked among the people like this? He is like that, he is a fighter, and he will, of course, fight. And he's motivated. Julia is motivated. Zelensky, we have already gone through it.

Julia is now trying to carry out... she needs a jerk. If she doesn’t gain 5-8% now, then she can no longer be counted.

Valentin Filippov: How can she gain her rating now?

Oleg Tsarev: Well, one option is a number of candidates who should come out in support of it. She must show the command. To say: this one will be the prosecutor general, this one will be the head of the SBU, this one will be the minister so and so, we will restore order in the country. And now negotiations are underway with a number of politicians. Nalyvaichenko will obviously come out in support of her. If everything ends well, and 5-8-10 people come out in support of it, of course, it will have an effect. Not only due to the fact that their votes will go to her, but due to the fact that just people will see the team.

Valentin Filippov: If Zelensky gains his ratings due to the fact that he is not involved in anything, then Yulia Vladimirovna can present that I have my own team, alternative to Poroshenko’s.

Oleg Tsarev: We see that when a representative from the State Department came to Ukraine, he met with Zelensky, he met with Tymoshenko, obviously, he met with Poroshenko….

Valentin Filippov: I understand that you have said the main thing for today. That's how you can title this interview. “About how Tsarev raised Poroshenko.” I think people will go to this title.

Oleg Tsarev: I remember, I was standing near the podium, I was asked to stand, one of our people spoke, who - I don’t remember, someone from the leadership of our party, and there was a risk that they would not allow the podium there and would block it.

I walked over and just stood up. And the speech was important, and it caused so much indignation in the hall that Yatsenyuk jumped up and ran. Here he is running to the podium, he jumped up with emotion, and then he saw me, then he slowed down, then he came up to me with such a quiet step and said: “Hello.”

I say: “Hello.” He sidesteps me and approaches the speaker on the other side, not the one where I’m standing, and says: “We are protesting, we are demanding...”.

Valentin Filippov: Oleg, excuse me, please, I am of course asking a naive question. There was something like this when deputies could resist other deputies. I remember when the fictitious Tymoshenko was in the opposition, she and her faction easily seized some substation and turned off the lights in the Verkhovna Rada. At the moment, the “Opposition Bloc” has a not so small faction. And there are plenty of big guys there. But meanwhile they are told: “I forbid you to speak Russian, I turn off the microphone.” Well, what’s the problem with throwing this handsome Parubiy out of there, turning on the microphone back and speaking in Russian? Why now, when there seems to be a cult of violence in the country, right now has this become impossible?

Oleg Tsarev: Well, fear. And in order for this fear to exist, they carried out a series of murders. My friend, Sasha Peklushenko, fellow deputy, former governor...

Valentin Filippov: But we were always told that the Party of Regions are the main bandits. Films were made about this. Did they tell us how Akhmetov became Akhmetov? He killed all his competitors. And not once did he cope with political opponents. Okay, this is not for an interview - this is me. We found ourselves with some toothless bandits.

Oleg Tsarev: What are the prospects, huh? We could now say who will definitely win. They constantly ask: “Who will win?”

Valentin Filippov: America.

Oleg Tsarev: It's clear. But who will lead the plunder of Ukraine? It’s difficult to say, because Petro Poroshenko has administrative resources. Arsen Avakov has spoken now... he flew to the United States of America and received carte blanche to fight falsifications. Petro Poroshenko gave the command to the governors to build relationships with the local police. Believe me, as not the last person in the Dnepropetrovsk region, the governor and the chief policeman are people who master the budget together, attend all birthdays together, they constantly communicate, they have established business corruption ties.

And a tough command was issued - to tear the local police officers away from Avakov. This is the first thing, but this is not the main thing.

The most important thing is that Arsen himself was afraid of what was happening. The street is getting out of control. He took carte blanche to restore order in Ukraine, but not to rock the boat. Therefore, this is the situation with Arsen.

And Petya Poroshenko has every chance to rig and win the elections, but we must understand that the next elections are parliamentary ones, his country will be in a fever, he definitely will not have a majority in parliament. And the rejection of this falsification, which everyone now knows about, abroad and inside Ukraine, will be such that it is even possible completely...

Valentin Filippov: Well, God forbid. Russia then will not recognize the elections, then, from Russia’s point of view, there will be no president in Ukraine, and, therefore, we all have a little bit of a free hand.

Oleg Tsarev: We talked about the fact that now Poroshenko and Tymoshenko are more profitable to meet with each other than with Zelensky in the second round. Tymoshenko and Poroshenko can control the elections and, in fact, the commissions can draw any option.

Valentin Filippov: Well, we will understand...

Oleg Tsarev: But they can only do this if they agree among themselves. But if they agree among themselves, we will see it, it will be impossible to hide it, there is such a possibility that Zelensky’s votes will be scattered among other candidates. If this happens, Julia, yes, will be indignant, but not much. If this happens, we will know about it and will definitely say so.

Valentin Filippov: Okay, thank you very much.