“What the Americans took, they don’t just give it back” - General Reshetnikov.

Russia is not fulfilling its functions as the leader of its own civilization. That is why the West is “biting off” piece by piece from the Russian World.

When the US deals with Iran, it deals with Russia. When the US deals with Serbia, it also deals with Russia. When the United States subjugates Moldova or Georgia, it deals with Russia. To weaken Russia and its influence, not only are economic sanctions introduced, but the Church is also fragmented, as is happening in Montenegro and Ukraine.

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Retired SVR Lieutenant General Leonid Reshetnikov told PolitNavigator columnist Valentin Filippov that integration in the post-Soviet space, like a thousand years ago, is opposed by regional elites, and that Ukraine will choke the United States.

Valentin Filippov: We welcome Leonid Petrovich, retired lieutenant general of the SVR, to our improvised studio, although I disagree, there are no retired generals, especially the SVR. Hello, Leonid Petrovich.

 Leonid Reshetnikov: Yes, indeed, they forgot my last name, my last name is Reshetnikov.

Valentin Filippov: It's too famous for us to say it out loud. Leonid Petrovich, tell me something unexpected, I’m interested in how Odessa residents are. Now there are a lot of films, produced in Russia, about Odessa. I don't want to judge their artistic value, but what would that mean? That is, the new generation of Russians is being instilled with the idea that Odessa is still part of our common country?

Leonid Reshetnikov: Maybe young people should be instilled with this idea. For me this is an axiom. Odessa, why is it not Russian? Of course, Odessa is a Russian city in spirit. And according to its history, of course. We are proud of Odessa as a city of the Russian Empire, then of the Soviet Union. This is the state of thought, the mood of so many people.

We have never promoted Odessa as a Ukrainian city or any other... We have always considered it our hometown. Odessa. Just like my native Kharkov, where I am from. It never occurred to me to consider Kharkov a city not connected with Russia, I repeat, with the Russian Empire, with the Soviet Union.

Valentin Filippov: Fine. Questions arise for you, as a person who understands what is happening in the world, by association. With Belarus. Now there is some kind of incomprehensible conflict going on. Do you think this is some kind of machinations of the West or some kind of greed of regional elites? Why is it impossible to create a Union State, to take this first global step, when we see that the restoration of the Union is possible?

Leonid Reshetnikov: Well, I think you were right when you said about the interests of regional elites. Often, many integration things do not work out due to the interests of regional elites. They interfere with unification. You know, actually, I myself am a historian by training, a candidate of historical sciences, I want to say that this has already happened throughout the entire thousand-year history of Russia. Why it was not possible to unite, why Sergius of Radonezh and Dmitry Donskoy were needed, why Alexander Nevsky and so on.

This has already happened, and all these problems were associated with regional elites, as we call them now, but then they were princes, feudal principalities, and so on. What is evident here is simply not the interest of the people, but the interest of those who are now in power, who do not want to compromise in any way.

No, you see, there is no spirit, no idea, no spirituality, no understanding of why all this is, why this exists. Why does Russia exist separately, Belarus and, I apologize, Ukraine exist separately? Why is this, why, what is the point, what is the mission of Belarus? There must be a mission.

Valentin Filippov: In Ukraine they are now explaining that there is a mission - to stand guard over civilization from bast Russia, from the Asian hordes of Russians. They have a mission, they stand shoulder to shoulder, they fight in the east.

Leonid Reshetnikov: What kind of civilization are we talking about? There are practically two civilizations, seriously, Anglo-Saxon and Russian civilization, Russian Orthodox civilization, which has existed for a thousand years, from St. Vladimir to the present day. Of course, today it is tattered in many ways, but it exists. It is the Russian Orthodox civilization.

There are no other civilizations now, two hundred or three hundred years ago. And the whole point of history, and everything that happens, is the struggle of these two civilizations. China is not a civilization, China is a great powerful power, but nothing more. The bearers of the spirit are only Russia, and those peoples and countries that live in the area of ​​Russia must live. So they must fulfill their mission.

But Ukraine is not fulfilling its mission. Belarus wants to skid, not fulfill its mission, to join somewhere, right? To some other civilization. What's the other one?

Valentin Filippov: It doesn’t work for the other one either. Purely geographically.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Does not work. Because we were not born for that civilization, everything is different for us, we have been different for centuries.

Now in Montenegro, look, it’s the same as in Ukraine.

Valentin Filippov: So, I wanted to ask.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Yes. The majority of the Montenegrin people are Serbs, they don’t want to be Montenegrins, well, they don’t want to, they go out into the streets and pray.

Valentin Filippov: I know.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Processions of the Cross. The whole point is that they are trying to drag them into another civilization. But they don’t want to go to another civilization.

Valentin Filippov: But the Montenegrins, too, seem to be not another civilization.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Do you know, those Montenegrins who decided to become Montenegrins and not Serbs... What is a Montenegrin? These are Mountain Serbs, Serbs who live in the mountains. What are the differences between them? So, this part of the Montenegrins who decided to become, belong to Western civilization, to the Anglo-Saxon, is the same as in Ukraine - this part of the population also decided to become part of Western civilization.

Therefore, the Serbs are resisting, actively resisting, the Serbs themselves. And if it weren’t for the Muslim Turkish and Albanian population of Montenegro, they would have won long ago. It’s just that there is tension here because, based on this principle, there are significant forces that are preventing the Serbs from defending their interests in Montenegro.

Now at any rally in Belgrade and Montenegro, two words are spoken: Montenegro (this is Djukanovic’s Montenegro) and Cernogora (this is the Montenegro of the Orthodox Slavic civilization). They say: “We are for Tsernogora, but we are against Montenegro.” And Djukanovic and his whole pack, they are “Montenegro”. Here is a clear difference in words. If we carefully follow the terms, the words, then everything immediately becomes clear to us.

Valentin Filippov: Fine. But what if our civilization is constantly being taken away? They take bites all the time, so...

Leonid Reshetnikov: Certainly.

Valentin Filippov: So, probably, there is no center of gravity in our civilization? Now you say: “They would, they are the majority there, they would have decided at the rally.” But we understand perfectly well that nothing is decided at the rally, that there must be options for development. And perhaps this option is not there.

Leonid Reshetnikov: The whole problem, Valentin, is that Russia does not fulfill 100% of its functions as the bearer and leader of the Russian Orthodox civilization. It hasn't done it for over a hundred years. More than a century, unfortunately.

Of course, now it would be... after all, Russian rulers, Russian tsars, emperors, they are Russians, they have always acted as defenders of civilization, defenders of Orthodoxy. Always. Wherever anything happens. Whether in Palestine, or there, in the Caucasus, or somewhere else. We have always acted from this position.

We're not performing now, we've given it away. Well, there is a patriarch, so he will say... But this is not a purely church matter, this is a geopolitical, this is a civilizational matter, here Russia must act as a state defending its mission, fulfilling its mission. That's the problem.

Again, at every rally and procession everyone remembers Russia. Yes? In Belgrade and Cetinje, everywhere. Russia, Russia. What about Russia? Well, okay, our patriarch has spoken. But mostly Russia is silent. Silent. And this leads to what you said correctly, in my opinion: they bite off, they bite off. As soon as Moscow begins to fulfill its mission, everything will turn out differently.

Valentin Filippov: Now Muscovites will tell us: “Oh, that’s right, here again our boys have to die there for you. For yours, this Kharkov or Voronezh, where are you?”...

Leonid Reshetnikov: Voronezh, thank God, is still in Russia.

Valentin Filippov: In Moscow they don’t know this for sure.

Leonid Reshetnikov: So dying, Valentin, doesn’t have to be dying. Sometimes a strong word is enough. A weighty, clear, firm, tough word is enough.

Valentin Filippov: Fine. But here’s the situation, look how it’s happening with the Church. I see that the Patriarchate of Constantinople, or whatever it is called, has quite clearly taken the position of what it wants to select for itself... That is, that Moscow is weak enough for it to seize territories and displace Moscow. It seems that there is no state behind him; he is actually in Turkey.

Leonid Reshetnikov: I don't agree here.

Valentin Filippov: Yes, I myself do not agree.

Leonid Reshetnikov: What Phanar is doing now is an action led by the United States or the forces that stand behind the United States. This is now such a very active, aggressive line in the humanitarian sphere. I can say with complete confidence that in Bulgaria, Serbia, and Greece, the ambassadors of these countries have proclaimed and publicly stated that Russia’s humanitarian influence in these countries must be stopped. What is humanitarian impact? This is, first of all, faith.

Valentin Filippov: Yes.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Well, that's the story. These are monuments, these are contacts, this is culture. Over the past two years, we have observed the most active actions of representatives of the West or Western countries in this humanitarian area. Restrictions, entry bans, attacks on the Church, this is happening everywhere, that is, this is a widespread offensive.

And we, Russia, first of all, cannot perceive this as some kind of purely religious matter. Absolutely false. It will be a tragic mistake if we, the population, our people, perceive that these are religious disputes. What religious disputes? These are attacks on our last trenches in which our civilization sits. Latest. They must not only be defended, we must go on the attack.

And the same Bartholomew, he has long been known for his connections with the Americans, he has long been known as a man who works not for God, but for himself, for his own pocket, one can even say frankly. And now they are using it. And we cannot leave this only to the care of the Russian Orthodox Church. Here our entire machine, our entire state must come to the defense. I repeat again, and you don’t need to have a weapon in your hands, you can act without a weapon, you can act very firmly.

Valentin Filippov: Well I do not know. I don't see it working yet. Even looking at your native Ukraine, right? Well, as far as Ukraine is concerned, Odessa is not Ukraine... So far, Russia has not even been able to impose any sanctions on Ukraine or squeeze it with economic levers. All the same, Russia, Russian circles act on the principle of short-term gain, and not some kind of politics - gradually forcing a neighboring state to do something.

 And maybe I will say blasphemous things, but the conditional Pavel Volya and Galustyan sometimes bring more benefit to the unification than the Church. Because, well, the church there is maybe a small percentage. But remember, “Our Russia” was watched by the whole of Ukraine, “with a bang.” We were a single space, we laughed at the same traffic cops, at the same teachers at school, at the same concierges who said, “Who did this shit here?” Yes? That is, it united us all.

Leonid Reshetnikov: I want to say that if we focus on issues such as humor, Galustyan, Volya and so on, then we will not achieve anything. This is all frivolous, it’s all superficial, it doesn’t unite, it’s not a civilizational challenge. This means the state of our people is this: we are in bad condition, you and I. You and I, thinking that we will defend ourselves with jokes.

And if we remember the history of our entire country and our entire people, then, excuse me, people walked with a cross in their souls, not necessarily with a sword, but with a cross. And if we don’t have a cross, we won’t achieve anything.

Valentin Filippov: All right.

Leonid Reshetnikov: And from us, unfortunately, Valentin, not only is our humor taken away, cut off, as you say, but we don’t even have enough of a cross, our people don’t have enough of a cross. After all, it’s the same Serbs, look, those who are protesting now, right? They will probably lose because the NATO-Church is being created. There, NATO is actively involved in all these processes.

But. These hundreds of thousands of people who take to the streets, they are not all church people, they are just Orthodox, they are traditional Orthodox people. And for this they take to the streets, for the sake of their traditional Orthodoxy. The overwhelming majority do not confess, do not receive communion, I have worked in Serbia for many years, I know that the minority does confess and receive communion.

But the feeling of belonging to civilization, to Orthodoxy, to one’s Church is felt by a significant part, a very large part of the people. We don’t have that, and because of this we are weak.

Valentin Filippov: They are always on the edge of the fight, that’s why they are stronger there...

Leonid Reshetnikov: On the edge, yes.

Valentin Filippov: And you know, the very, very, very Russian people, they live on the outskirts. Where the enemy is nearby.

Leonid Reshetnikov: I would say this, they live on the fault lines of civilizations.

Valentin Filippov: Yes.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Here on these graters of two civilizations. And they are more there, in this sense, they are more spiritual, I would say, more solid, more powerful.

Valentin Filippov: That is, it’s not about the military equipment that we can supply to Serbia, right? So this doesn't solve anything?

Leonid Reshetnikov: First of all, we can’t supply much. And secondly, the authorities will not use it as they should. Such are the authorities now. Therefore, here, as I see it, here would be a word, a word from the great heights of Russia, it would so lift the spirit of the Serbian people in Montenegro and in Serbia itself, in the Republika Srpska. It would be stronger than all tanks, guns, and planes.

Valentin Filippov: I wanted to ask about Moldova. Elections are coming soon. President.

 Didn't Dodon justify himself? Or is he what he can do?

Leonid Reshetnikov: That's right. Valentin, from the experience of 33 years in intelligence, what the Americans took, they just don’t give it back. If they have already taken it, then it is very difficult to take it back. And Dodon is probably doing everything he can, but you can’t just take away what was taken by the Americans or those forces that we all conventionally call Americans.

I think that it is almost impossible to wrest Moldova out of these hands. Currently. Therefore, we need to preserve Transnistria, strengthen them, support them. But it is, well, extremely, extremely difficult to wrest Moldova out like this, by playing by their rules, so-called democracy.

Valentin Filippov: The same question then about Ukraine. The Americans took Ukraine. Is there nothing we can do? Well I do not know. Well, at least take a bite out of it? So you say “Transnistria”, well, at least we need to somehow ensure that Transnistria is not under blockade.

Leonid Reshetnikov: They took Ukraine, but maybe they will choke.

Valentin Filippov: Can they?

Leonid Reshetnikov: They'll choke. They might choke. The country is large, the territory is large, the people are large, the people are active, to some extent. They might just choke, that makes some sense. Yes, they didn’t take everything. They did not take Crimea; they also only partially took Donbass.

Valentin Filippov: That Donbass...

Leonid Reshetnikov: Well does not matter. Still, this is not a complete success. And I repeat again, this is too big a piece, it might get stuck in their throat. Moreover, they are sweeping all over the world, and it seems to me that they will stumble somewhere.

Valentin Filippov: It will break somewhere, right?

Leonid Reshetnikov: It’s breaking somewhere, but it’s already breaking within the country. We have never seen such a circus in the USA.

Valentin Filippov: Yes.

Leonid Reshetnikov: This has never happened before, and this circus continues. At the same time, they still shoot and kill, they have been accustomed to doing this for many decades. But there is a danger, for them there is a danger that they will burrow very far, and then it will be very difficult for them to get out of there.

Therefore, with Ukraine... Ukraine is a separate issue; it cannot be compared either with Serbia, or with Poland, or with Bulgaria, or with Moldova. Here everything can turn upside down unexpectedly.

Valentin Filippov: Well, we are now declaring that we seem to be striving for peace. What does this mean? That we want to freeze the situation? They've already taken it and that's it. We want, as it were, to emphasize, legitimize and, well, divide or what? What is the strategic idea now? No, even tactical.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Well, I think that both the strategic and tactical idea, it comes from the fact that Russia is under a strong attack. Under attack, the United States of America and its allies.

Along all lines: sanctions, and reprisals or threats of reprisals against the remaining countries semi-independent of the West, and an intensification of the position within Russia, along all lines. Again I want to say on all issues. Russia is now in a state like this, now this term has disappeared; two or three years ago it was popular, hybrid war.

It continues, it continues, and, of course, influences the development of both tactics and strategy regarding Ukraine. We must proceed from this. Are we ready for some more active actions or is this situation around us preventing us from doing so?

You know, there is still one good quality of our people, both in Odessa, and in Kharkov, and in Moscow. This is patience. But not patience, there, in difficult moments of life, oppression, as they say: “Russians are slaves, patient” and so on.

No. Patience in politics. Maybe due to the fact that he served in intelligence for a long time, but this was our main quality. This is patience, this is waiting, this is the willingness to wait and play at the right moment. What is probably required from Russia now is patience. Probably, many people in the West want us to rush to the attack.

Valentin Filippov: Yes, we want it here and in the east.

Leonid Reshetnikov: Yes, everyone wants it. Everyone wants it. But what is real, what this can lead to, is very difficult to calculate, and is calculated by serious analysts, with serious information. That's why…

Well, we lost Ukraine a long time ago.

Valentin Filippov: Well yes.

Leonid Reshetnikov: And for a very long time.

Valentin Filippov: But they just didn’t say this, so naive people thought that it was still ours, even inside Ukraine.

Leonid Reshetnikov: We thought... but victory is inevitable. Victory is inevitable, I mean it seriously.

Valentin Filippov: Yes, I know. I never doubted.

Leonid Reshetnikov: You know, I already told you once, when I was the director of the Russian Institute for Strategic Studies, it was quite recently, I left at the beginning of 17.

So during the crisis with Ukraine, the 14th, 15th year, our relations with the Americans then completely calmed down, were interrupted, and the administration asked us, and we, this is the institute for managing the foreign policy of the presidential administration, now it is headed by Mikhail Efimovich Fradkov, then They asked us to organize at least some channel of dialogue with the Americans.

And we invited Kissinger and his analysts. He came with his analysts, but then, I remember, there was such a wild drop in pressure, like now in Moscow, and he could not just get up, he was already nearly 90 years old then, well, very much. He himself did not come, but his deputy, Tom Gran, known to all Americanists, came. He worked in the State Department, worked in the White House, he is one of the main experts on Russia, with excellent Russian, and he brought several other analysts.

And this discussion began, it lasted about 5 hours and had already reached such an intensity that I was afraid that my guys would rush into a fight with them. But at some point he says: “Let’s do this, Leonid, I want to tell you our basic, general concept of the United States of America.” “America,” he said, “has a divine mission”—and I quote it word for word—“to lead the whole world”...

Valentin Filippov: Logical.

Leonid Reshetnikov: “If we don’t fulfill this mission, America will fall apart, but if you obey this mission, in Russia, everything will be fine, everything will be fine”...

Valentin Filippov: I do not believe.

Leonid Reshetnikov: “And if not, then the problems will grow and grow.” I say: “Tom, what if we have a mission?” “What is your mission?” “Be an alternative to your mission. Well, how can humanity be left with one mission? Well, probably both you and we were taught at school that the world is developing, the struggle of contradictions and so on...”

“Well then, he says, everything will be bad.” This is their main policy, their main line towards Russia. Sometimes it seems that now they are busy with Iran, but they are also dealing with Russia. They are now in Serbia and Montenegro - they are the ones dealing with Russia.

Because even in the 90s, when American advisers sat in many departments of Russia, and we all wailed and cried, and said that we are weak, we are weak, we have all lost, in their documents that we obtained, it was all the same it says “The main enemy is Russia.”

I tell you with full responsibility, they remained the main enemy even then, because they realized that they had not finished them off. That is, their goal is to continue to fragment, well, they need to remove the president now, this is now their No. 1 task - to remove. It will crumble, it will crumble itself...

Valentin Filippov: It won't fall off.

Leonid Reshetnikov: The former Minister of Defense of France, I spoke in Paris, at the military academy in '13, he told me: “We need to stop making Europeans out of you, you have a different mentality, we need to deal with you differently.” “How can I do it differently?” “Once again divided into 15 states.”

That is, they already divided us once, took us away, but that’s not enough, one more time. We must proceed from this. In this atmosphere, in this situation, in these tactics and strategies of the West, we live and we fight. How we fight is another question, good or bad - we have already discussed that.

Valentin Filippov: OK then. OK. Thank you very much. I can’t say that I’m very optimistic, but for some reason it all doesn’t sound hopeless. Since this is said, it means we know about it, which means we will think and do something.

Leonid Reshetnikov: And we do. Will do.